I now have reason to believe the note below, which I received from an anonymous source, is genuine.
To whom it may concern.
Thank you very much for your detailed breakdown for the various maintenance work. After dialogue with the other contractors, we are all in agreement that the winning tender has been unrealistically successful, particularly when in most sections the score of 100% has been achieved.
Having perused just a few sections of the works, further difficulties present themselves, for example, some of the jobs that will be undertaken have NIC EIC Select or Gas safe approval as a minimum standard. After careful enquiry, the winning contractor is not a member of any of the mentioned bodies. how this contractor could score higher than companies who have the relevant bodies acclaim, and who do this work year on year, is a mystery.
Therefore we would be grateful if details were returned of how exactly the scoring was analysed and allocated, and who was on the panel for the task.
At this time we hope that a third party will not have to get involved.
Finally we respectfully request that the contract was adjourned until satisfactory answers emerge.
.
John MacDonald, on behalf of :
.
AB Electronics
ACES Electrical
Point 1
Cal Max Construction
O Mac Construction
John Murray & co Builders
Neil MacKay & Co Ltd
Floor to Floor Ltd
Angus MacKay & Sons
Totally baffled by the council tendering process. If substantial money is not being paid in compensation because of council errors there are major question marks over why certain organisations get contracts. The tendering process needs to become more transparent, not that I’m saying that there is anything untowards. There are number of questions have to be answered, but hear nothing.
The money which has been wasted on tendering compensation could have prevented the school bus issue. Why did we pay £500K to UBC on the week of the local election just before UBC went bust. We have brought in outside contractors only to have problems with the work we have done.
The new schools all have problems with their roofs, the sports centre was the same. We need more transparency.
I think DC we should be privy to the scoring system for tendering as I know they are weighted price over quality but what other factors are taken into consideration. You are so right in this economic climate we cannot afford to have services detrimentally affected because of compensation payments due to poor tendering processes. Transparency and accountability we should told who is responsible for these “cock-ups” then maybe less of them will occur.
What was it that the man said the last time about lessons being learned ? if this is proven, this time heads will roll .
Surely they can subcontract the specialised parts of the contract out, like most contracts.
Then they would be marked down on quality as they would be subcontracting.
Surely CNES should have chosen companies with a proven track record of the work they say they can carry out, its not rocket science. Will any of the “panel” be taken to task for this, I doubt it….
UBC awarded contracts when they cant get local sub-contractors due to lack of confidence, somethings not right. UBC awarded contracts when they have not even stated who they will be using as sub-contractors, suspect!
Name & shame
Sounds like a whole lot of sour grapes to me!!
The local building industry is critical to our local economy, if that’s in tatters our economy will end up in tatters. It would be great if it was only sour grapes, unfortunately we can’t have local trades people unemployed while outside contractors do local work.
We are all affected by some of the council’s crazy decision, the council are supposed to promote our economy, not destroy it.
Sour grapes, a wee bit more serious than that when peoples livelyhoods are involved. Who is going to employ the apprentices left high & dry now that the schools are complete?
@DC
“We can’t have local trades people unemployed while outside contractors do local work”.
Had to laugh at that. Get a reality check! What makes you so special….are the Western Isles a protected game reserve that is off limits to Johhny Foreigner (ie other Scots amongst others) coming here to work and earn an honest living?? I think not.
If mistakes have been made, then its only right they should be resolved, and if that means suspending the appointment until an investigation is done, then fine – First Group replacing Virgin on the mainland, does that ring any bells???? So it’s a problem all over, not just on the islands. Public sector procurement is too complicated and therefore too prone to human error. when reults are being subjectively scored.
@Skip
Apprentice numbers on the islands, and not just construction related, have been in freefall years. How many local companies employed apprentices during the schools project? Now remember, and to make it easier for ‘others’ on the blog to understand, the schools project was additional expenditure over and above the normal Council capital programme that was largely funded by central government, so that should have provided a boost to the underlying workload that would have been there anyway from the nomal (public and private sector) client base on the islands.
Not many I bet. As I understand, the majority were employed by off-island contractors, so who is to say they are still not working for them, or on Lews Castle for example?
Monus Yawn!! Yawn!!! what is it you are saying Yawn!! Yawn!!!
run along and let the adults continue with this serious discussion.
You are the child. You are naive, belligerent and really not the ‘alpha’ blogger you think you are. Good arguement though. As well crafted as always comrade!
Monus run along and away out and play before it gets dark. You can do your homework when you come back in before going to bed.
What a D i C k . . . . . .
Since ‘he’ started it…..
Name calling is a cognitive bias and a technique to promote propaganda. Propagandists use the name-calling technique to incite fears or arouse positive prejudices with the intent that invoked fear (based on fearmongering tactics) or trust will encourage those that read, see or hear propaganda to construct a negative opinion, in respect to the former, or a positive opinion, with respect to the latter, about a person, group, or set of beliefs or ideas that the propagandist would wish the recipients to believe.
The method is intended to provoke conclusions and actions about a matter apart from an impartial examinations of the facts of the matter. When this tactic is used instead of an argument, name-calling is thus a substitute for rational, fact-based arguments against an idea or belief, based upon its own merits.
This is about a local contractor,so stop fretting about the irish bogeyman!
I thought it was about the fairness of the council tendering process which affects us all. I don’t know if there is a problem with fairness but I do know substantial sums have been paid out on contractual issues. There is a definitely a problem with transparency on the councils part.
Looks as though it has been transparent enough that 9 of the other tendering contractors think there is a problem….
“Get a reality check! What makes you so special….are the Western Isles a protected game reserve that is off limits to Johhny Foreigner (ie other Scots amongst others) coming here to work and earn an honest living?? I think not.”
I sooooo agree with that statement. People here seem to think that the island economy is something that needs protecting at all costs. Get… a… life!!! If there’s no jobs, people will have to go elsewhere to look for work, just like they do in every other part of rural Britain. But oh dear, no, we can’t have that can we, youngsters leaving the island, they might just find there’s a big wide world outside Stornoway, and if they do the island community will die!!! What community? Is it really worth protecting in the first place?
As for local builders ………..
During the hurricane of 2005 our shed/outbuilding was blown away. A builder in the village agreed to build a new one providing that the insurance money of just over £1000 was paid directly to him (we were providing our own materials). The money came through and we duly (naively!) paid him. He sent a clueless apprentice down twice to make a start on the building, and then we never saw the lad again. My husband ended up building the shed in between work and other commitments. When threatened with legal action, said builder eventually coughed up about £300, and that was all we saw of him. I have heard many many many similar tales of how builders cashed-in on the storm and ripped off the public, and for far greater sums than ours.
Latterly we have been waiting for a different builder to come and replace some slates on our roof. The roof is leaking and he promised last December that he would nip round to do the job. We asked him again in April and he was going to “fit it in whilst it was dry”. We are still waiting.
If these are examples of the integrity and reliability of individual island builders one can only assume that the problem is multiplied a hundredfold by the bigger companies. If island companies (be they builders or any other) want to be taken seriously they have to learn honesty, reliability, and the concept that “urgent” means “now”, not “maybe sometime next month!”
Rant over
Does any of that have anything to do with the councils tendering process?
Does that have anything to do with awarding work to companies that have no proven track record in the work that has been awarded to them by CNES?
Does that explain why work is awarded to companies having severe money problems leaving sub contractors & the public out of pocket. Could it actually be possible that CNES have actually made some maistakes? Would CNES ever say they have made mistakes? Have they ever come under scutiny for their tendering process in the past? Have they every had to pay out public money to mis-treated contractors before? Tina sounds like you may have a vendetta aginst local builders. What is wrong with wanting something for our own people, what is wrong with us wanting to try and keep our children here?
It is absolutely disgusting what’s happening to the local construction industry! Yet if any body stands up to it they will lose what little work they have. It’s high time the gloves come off and we defend our work on our islands and sod the rest of them.
What Skip says is 100% true, island builders should not all be classed as bad builders because of a few cowboys.
I wonder if the so called builders this lady reders to are registered builders ? Also, where money is paid and work not being done, it is a case fore the dept of fair trading.
@ I D M
Sorry, what’s happening that’s so ‘disgusting’ ?
No vendetta, just an expectation of quality and timely service which is all but non-existent on the island!
What the heck is all this stuff about “our own people” ? Who are they that they’re so special? If someone can do a decent job, it shouldn’t matter where they come from, someone is being given work be they Irish, Welsh, English, Pakistani, Indian or anybody else. If islanders want to be taken seriously in a competitive market then they should absolutely have to meet the same standards and criteria as everyone else, and giving a company or an individual employment because he’s an islander, or because his uncle was a second cousin to somebody else’s granny’s mother – in-law is just corrupt. But there we have it – that’s what this island exists on – corruption. All nicely labelled as “looking after our own”, “providing jobs for our children”, and that old chestnut “community”.
Stinks. Pah!
Second rant over – for now
“What the heck is all this stuff about “our own people” ? Who are they that they’re so special?” Nice
“quality and timely service which is all but non-existent on the island!” Nice
“If someone can do a decent job, it shouldn’t matter where they come from” Correct, never said it was, dont put words in my mouth
“If islanders want to be taken seriously in a competitive market then they should absolutely have to meet the same standards and criteria as everyone” Now your talking, meet the same standards and criteria as everyone else, I will remind you of the letter on the top of the page.
Still no answers to any of the questions asked, dont change the subject anymore, why do CNES see it as ok to award work to a company, where ever that comany is from, with no track record in that line of work????
Please have a go at that one
Why did CNES award contracts to companies up to their hard hats in debt ready to go pop at any time, did CNES even consider it could happen. Smiley face, rant on
@momus (cut & paste specialist)
one of the guys who was in our office looking for a job, just finished 1 year on the new schools job, He is not up at the Castle, he is knocking on the door of all the local contractors desperate for work so that the last year was not a complete waste of time. He had 2 weeks to get another job or miss his college start which would have delayed him another year. Completely left in the lurch.
I will print off your response so if any more turn up at my door I will just hand them that….im sure they will understand.
When you take on an apprentice you take a responsability to get that apprentice through to being qualified, if that is not the intention and the intention is to get rid of them when they finish their first year, thats wrong.
I remember the story in the Gazzette, councillors, FMP or JBE and a couple of apprentices, looked good. Taking on an apprentice is easy, getting them through to the end is not so easy. They are real people, they have faces and everything, not just a number or statistic on some spreadsheet
I didn’t say it wasn’t. What about ADM or UBC when they left apprentices in the lurch? Why are local companies not employing them? Numbers have been down for years
Momus there is a good children’s playpark in Berwick, away down and play in it like a good boy.
As for the skill levels of local builders, they are as good as anywhere else. The skills tradesmen and contractors who were brought in to build the new schools are only now visible for scutiny. The initial indications are not good as I believe local builders are now trying to make the buildings water tight. This brings into question the decision by our council. As for as discrimination against local workers, there are signs that our local authority may be showing a preference towards outside contractors. If this is the case, it is wrong.
We need as much investment in these islands as we can get. To have a negative bias towards local companies will turn the place into another St Kilda. People won’t be able to sell their homes when they move away. They will still be paying a mortgage for a house they no llonger live in. There will be no market for leasing either as everyone moves out. Most people will be in a state of ruin as incomes drop.
@DC
I appreciate that you have been handicapped from birth by swimming in the shallow end of the gene pool, so I refuse to have a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.
@skip
You don’t say if the apprentice was employed by a local contractor or one of the off islands ones. If off island, was he offered the choice of moving with them or did he choose to stay on Lewis for example? This is relevant info, but as the entire construction industry is in the toilet at present, nowhere is immune to the current very difficult and competitive trading environment. At least thanks (a small thanks maybe) to the schools project and that sub-contractor he has gained some real practical experience that can be put to good use now or in the future. The alternative might have been signing on for that year or taking a low paid job with no prospects, so which is more desirable?
To work as an 1st year apprentice and then not progress to complete, that is what I would call a low paid job with no prospects, what would you call it.
Why the need to defend everyone else but attack local builders/business?
When did I attack local builders? I queried why they (local contractors) are not employing apprentices when the schools project was additional expenditure. Abd dimply noted that apprentice numbers gave been in freefall for years. So the apprentice was fortunate to get one year behind him however you didn’t say if he was given the opportunity to move with the contractor or decided to stay.
We are way off topic. If procurement mistakes have been made, hopefully they will be addressed and a fair solution reached.
Skip, why are you arguing with this wee boy monus. He has no idea about the building industry or the reality of life. I’ve heard a better logical arguement from an eight year old. It is obvious that he has never faced any of the challenges that most of have had to face. If our council had broken up the contract into individual tenders for each school local builders would be in a stronger position. Obviously monus is new labour tory.
DC, im done with that, like banging you head off a brick wall, there must be another argument somewhere for the schools contract. I think we should concentrate on the issue raised in the letter at the top of the page.
How contracts are awarded, could it be the people who are enpowered with such decisions have such a dismal view of local business, they talk about meeting the criteria yet seem to ignore it at the same time. its all about price but cheapest option has a habit of biting back. Firms putting in low prices for jobs while already loaded with debt, would set off alarm bells but all they can see is the price at the bottom of the page. What is the set up,
95% price
0% proven record of work to be carried out
5% to be discussed at at onther meeting
Why ask companies for copies of accounts, only to see them end up liquidated amidst large contracts. There was another firm far better placed to carry out the work but cheapest price wins every time.
Despite what DC stated to be factual information on a previous thread, the school contract was actually awarded on the basis of a combination and weighting of cost, quality and financial standing. It was not awarded purely on a cheapest cost scenario.
Sounds like lessons learnt are not being applied in handling procurement matters given previous outcomes.
As a side note, I have absolutely no interest in politics so why DC keeps insisting on attaching these party political allegiances to people with whom he disagrees is unknown to me. There is obviously some sort of skewed logic at work within his own thick skull – a failed politician perhaps???
Momus – You refer to ADM. ADM was the best company I ever dealt with, personal attention and excellent workmanship. Nothing was a problem and work was carried out as it should be – on time and within budget.
Skip I fully agree. Unfortunately the old myth that things are greener on the other side appears to be the deceptive agenda when it comes to local builders. Like every other part of the country, there are those who call themselves building contractors who are in fact just cowboys. Unfortunately this image is being used by some to describe all island contractors. This appears to be the unfair tactics adopted by some of ourcouncillors. What their agenda is, needs to made clear. The knock effect of decrying local builders will drive down the prosperity of all island business’s affecting every household. It is within our council’s remit to promote the local business’s not talk them down. In today’s economic climate, this is probably the only council who is working against local business and Skip you are right, we need to know why.
Never mind arguing about the builders – what about the repeated incompetence shown by the Council? Their Legal department doesn’t answer letters, has files a mile high on their desk and lets things drag on for years in the hope the problem will go away. Most of the people there have no idea what it is like to run a struggling small business, and they get paid whether or not the job is done well. And most of them wouldn’t last 10 minutes in a mainland council.
What about the council ? They have just been returned for another five years.